Comments on: Views of Doha

By: jpgreenword

jpgreenword — Fri, 14 Dec 2012 14:39:07 +0000

Thanks Martin! And a happy holidays to you as well

By: Martin Lack

Martin Lack — Fri, 14 Dec 2012 10:13:19 +0000

Thanks JP. May I also take this opportunity to wish you a (politically-correct) “Happy Holiday”…?

By: jpgreenword

jpgreenword — Fri, 14 Dec 2012 00:10:15 +0000

“Good analogies, Martin and Jules.”

I’ll second that. Although, for some reason, Martin’s second-last sentence really struck a nerve… “Today, most humans enjoy burning fossil fuels too much.” And that’s the problem. We enjoy our way of life too much to worry about any negative consequences it may have.

By the way, great post Martin!

By: Martin Lack

Martin Lack — Thu, 13 Dec 2012 09:55:02 +0000

Thanks. That is almost – but not quite – as good as, “Nostalgia ain’t what it used to be”…

By: Christine

Christine — Thu, 13 Dec 2012 06:11:34 +0000

You might appreciate this quote I just came across “We must postpone our pessimism for better times” – Eduardo Galeano.

By: Martin Lack

Martin Lack — Wed, 12 Dec 2012 19:29:45 +0000

Thanks Christine. Memo to self: I must try to be more optimistic (although I think the uncertainty is diminishing rapidly).

By: Christine

Christine — Wed, 12 Dec 2012 17:13:08 +0000

Good analogies, Martin & Jules. With both my husband and I having healthcare backgrounds, it’s one that rings very true – very few of my husband’s patients quit smoking because they are told that it’s bad for them (although more of the women – but not all – quit when they are pregnant, for the sake of their unborn child’s health). I agree that we haven’t evolved to consider the long term consequences of our actions; the current moment is, I think we can all agree, an excellent opportunity to evolve as a species or die. The outcome remains uncertain.

By: Martin Lack

Martin Lack — Wed, 12 Dec 2012 14:54:33 +0000

Thanks Jules. All of what you say reminds me of the importance of the fallacy at the heart of The Age of Enlightenment: Humans now think themselves separate from - and superior to - Nature; and therefore delude themselves they can dominate and control it. Hence the reality that climate change is "the greatest market failure in history" (Stern) and "a failure of modern politics" (Hamilton). My Mum was born in 1928 and, having decided to stop smoking 25 years ago when she got fed up of coughing, she has COPD but is still alive. My Dad was born in 1926 and, having decided to stop smoking 30 years ago when he got a bad case of pneumonia, he started again some years later. He died 3 years ago. Anyone can stop smoking if they really want to; however some people just enjoy it too much. Today, most humans enjoy burning fossil fuels too much. Therefore, without doubt, there will be unpleasant consequences.

By: Martin Lack

Martin Lack — Wed, 12 Dec 2012 14:28:46 +0000

It is the very least I can do Paul. Given the self-inflicted curtailment of my own browsing, you are proving to be an invaluable pointer to things I should read.

By: julesbollocks

julesbollocks — Wed, 12 Dec 2012 14:27:05 +0000

Are we expecting too much from our leaders and ourselves?

I ask it because human history has few examples of where the generation of the present changed their lives for the generations of the future. Unfortunately the complex nature of AGW has meant that superficially the speed of change is not apparent or particularly clear. We don’t really know what is going on in the oceans, we know there is heat build up, we know more energy in the system will drive the weather to extremes but at the moment the future is rather opaque. Are we as a species actually capable of making long term decisions based on an uncertain future?

I smoke, I know its harmful and sound predictions determine it will likely kill me- but [and this despite my fathers death from smoking- at 82!] it seems to have little effect on my determination now. I still have a future and I can make amends then. The problem is that humans- myself even- are optimistic, we live now; we can’t even think our way through a local human crisis like Syria and make a sound decision. What ever we do will cock things up and without two or realities we never know if the decision we made is the right one.

The decision we have collectively made is to get rich because it appears to be the best survival strategy. Lots of stuff = a long and happy life. And the sad truth is that the West- us- who have pursued this will have better chance of survival in coming decades than countries that have not been able.

If we are to collectively change minds then the approach may have to be the same as the smoker- we need reasons now- not for one in 20-30-80 years time. I marvelled at the Medieval cathedral builders who dedicated not only their own careers but their children’s in a 40 year building project, in comparison the Great Pyramid seems more like an olympic project lasting only 20 years.

Maybe we are not evolved enough and it is just the evolutionary end of the road.